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How Little Does American Airlines Pay For 737s?

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Wells Fargo has this item about what American Airlines actually paid for the Boeing 737-800, as opposed to the list price: more than a 50% discount from $84.4m. Note that AerCap (AER) appears to have paid $40m per aircraft in a purchase-leaseback. One assumes American didn’t resell the aircraft for the price paid from Boeing but marked them up at least a little bit. We’ve heard AA’s cost was in the range of $35m but this is unconfirmed. (leehamnews.wordpress.com) 更多...

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Moviela
50% discount? I want to buy my next car from Boeing.
padre2049
Craig David 2
Now I understand why the seats are so big and the fares so low...LMAO
fresnosmooth
Well played sir - HAHAHA
ltcjra
ltcjra 2
Open this article and at the bottom of the piece click on the 30 minute interview with Bob Crandall, former CEO of AA, and Peter Greenberg, Travel Editor at CBS, with Charlie Rose. A great discussion of airline issues. A lot of "food for thought" in the interview.
tarbaby
phil gibson 2
Bottom line is that the Aircraft are all LEASES! The Major Airlines do not own the fleet of aircraft. Look at the Registration Certificates located in the cockpit of the aircraft. You will see the Major Bank or Leasing Corp listed as the owner.
ADMorrill
ADMorrill 3
Apologies up front for the long post... I didn't mean to write this much when I started... @_@

But does anyone truly believe that any ultra high-profile, multi-million dollar airline like AA is 'sneaking' past the IRS and evading taxes illegally? Or that they are exploiting loopholes that the government has missed? The IRS can dig into any one of our pockets and look for loose change, and they can do it with a frightening level of impunity. I don't believe for a second that our government isn't intimately aware of what he airlines are up to.

That having been said, it probably IS completely accurate that AA (and all of the other airlines) are getting huge discounts from manufacturers and huge tax breaks from the government. The reasons why?

1) Capitalism. Aircraft manufacturers need to move their product... if they don't, they tend to go out of business. Makes sense, no? ^_^ So it really does not surprise me that an aircraft builder is willing to cut huge lease deals with airlines to get their products out in the marketplace. We don't know what their real margins are anyway and I'm sure there is more to it than what I have said... but even my grossly simplified view of it makes sense to me.

2) Infrastructure. Our country MUST transport vast numbers of people and goods in order for our economy to operate. It has always been this way. This is why railroads were built to span the country as it grew, it's why the interstate system was built, and it's why airlines have become what they are. It is also why states get HUGE financial incentives to update/maintain their roads/highways/freeways. Well, if the government uses federal tax dollars to maintain the road infrastructure, why is it surprising that they also give huge tax breaks to airlines and other carrier services? Imagine if they DID tax the crap out of the airlines? Who would end up paying for those increased cost burdens? WE would! And if air travel became too expensive for us to use it (it almost is anyway!), then what would happen to that industry? It would implode! Have we forgotten how bad it was after 9-11 when the skies were closed for only a few days? What a mess that was! ...No, it is completely logical to think that our government is all about giving the airlines a pass when it comes to sales tax on aircraft purchases. And whether or not it's fair is irrelevant... we all still benefit from it.

Again, sorry about the long post/soapbox thing. ;)

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

ADMorrill
ADMorrill 5
If your reply was even remotely rational I would be appalled by what you just said. It is expected and acceptable to disagree with my perspective of this issue, but there is no excuse for your vitriolic personal attack. Are you a member of this forum only so you can troll the threads looking for reasons to spout hate? You have issues sir...
MrTommy
MrTommy 2
What in the world are you talking about?
fresnosmooth
Cookies n milk maybe?
ltcjra
ltcjra 1
Beer and hot dogs....with plastic utensils!!!
drpepper
ed george 1
Right, and I am going to believe ANYTHING Wells Fargo says. Can someone link to a report on mortgage ethics from Bank Of America next?
RobSJC
Fleet sales at Boeing ? Makes one wonder, how many you have to buy, to get a discount ... and how can a bankrupt carrier afford to "buy" or get financing on anything ?? Maybe AA was already in the back pocket of US Airways.
TXCAVU
JetBlue got their planes for FREE for the first 3 years, then began making payments.
9039
Thank u for the tip Liz...so I as a black man who wants to open my widget shop will ask to have my rent suspended for three years and request the same of my suppliers...nice...country isn't it...bite me...
fresnosmooth
This would be a good time to chill and have a snickers.
porterjet
porterjet 1
Most, if not all states exempt commercial aircraft from sales taxes. That is one reason why there are so many part 135 operations around. Flying a non-commercial airplane to a state where there is no sales tax is common, same as taking a boat offshore to do the paperwork. Even if AA paid sales tax it would be calculated on the actual purchase price not the list price, the same way sales tax is computed when you or I buy a car.
I hope nobody here thinks Avis pays list price for a fleet purchase of cars.
porterjet
porterjet 1
Another thought here, could be they are in a leasing arrangement where they are only amortizing 50% of the list price. At the end of the lease the leasing company still owns the airplane and can either sell it or lease it back out.
jcsflyboy
jcsflyboy 0
Plus, a little trick that the airlines use....
Lawyers from the airline and Boeing get on the aircraft about to be purchased, fly out off the coast of Washington over international waters, circle, sign the papers, and return to BFI. Why? To avoid paying sales tax!
mikem132
Really? I am aware of no state that does not exempt commercial aircraft from sales tax. No sales tax on industrial machinery and many other items used in industry to generate taxable revenue, either (just so you don't suspect this is some industry loophole).
rnizlek
Ross Nizlek 1
That seems to make sense.
shannonpence
Surely you can't be serious...
partsmanba
Yes he is... and don't call him Shirley!
CaptStephanC
Yes....Absolutely true.......Although I was not in the "loop" on a simular situation, since I had just been hired, I was involved in the pick up of a Lear 60, and the same type of a verification of location by MFD observation, and verification of position with ATC, it was later on insinuated to me why this "location" verification was so importantat! TAX EVASION! What transpired during this job really opened my eyes to the power of "money"......!
rnizlek
Ross Nizlek 1
Wouldn't they still owe use tax on the purchase, though? I'm not sure in what state, but it seems to me they would owe it.
porterjet
porterjet 1
No, use tax is what you pay on a lease instead of sales tax. Both are typically not charged on commercial aircraft.
learguy
Hey, wanna get a good deal on a bridge in Brooklyn? Gimme a call.
jkudlick
Source? Evidence?
Derg
Roland Dent 2
MY GOD..
Derg
Roland Dent 0
This is confidential commercial information..not in public domain.
bovineone
Jeff Lawson 4
Those amounts were apparently deduced from the budgetary values reported in public SEC filings. 50% discounts are probably common in the industry anyways.
Derg
Roland Dent 2
There is another way you can discount: by extended gurantees. If you haver the odd hour to fill try a Google search with the key words "JetBlue" "A320" and" "engines" along with "contract".
eagle763
John Hale 0
any body with a half a brain knows they don't pay sales tax. If they did then our taxes would not be going up but way down. Just think what sales tax would be on 150 planes at 40mil a piece.

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