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Pilots suspended after another Air India flight struggles during takeoff hours after Ahmedabad crash

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On 12 June, just 38 hours after the deadly Air India flight 171 crashed in Ahmedabad, killing over 260 people, another flight from the same airline from Delhi to Vienna faced a serious safety scare. During takeoff, the Boeing 777 flight AI187 reportedly lost about 900ft in altitude and triggered multiple warnings, including a “stall alert” and “don’t sink” Ground Proximity Warning System (GPWS), a report in The Times of India claimed. Both the “stall” and “don’t sink” warnings signal a dangerous… (www.msn.com) More...

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CHRISMORGAN
CHRIS MORGAN 18
It is reported as 'during a thunderstorm' so presumably turbulence would be an issue, nor do we do not know at what height (above ground level) the incident happened. A clear case of 'more information required'.
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TimDyck
Tim Dyck 3
I agree, there is very little information in that article to go on. The headline is clickbait.
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alanhewat
Alan Hewat 4
Multiple warnings including stall with a 900ft drop shortly after takeoff, so low altitude, with both pilots grounded and the head of safety summoned before the authorities. Sounds quite serious even with the limited information.
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mikeosmers
Michael Osmers 9
It’s important to use precise language here. Stick shaker is not a stall! Unlike most prop aircraft, modern jetliners do not have a natural aerodynamic warning when one is approaching the critical angle of attack (stall) so an automated system is installed to mimic that warning, that’s the “stick shaker”. Activation of the stick shaker is definitely not an indicator of stall although if no corrective action is taken, and angle of attack continues to increase to the critical angle, a stall will happen.
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alanhewat
Alan Hewat 3
"Notably, the initial flight report only cited “stick shaker due to turbulence”, omitting the more serious alerts, the report said. A deeper review of the flight data recorder later revealed that a stall warning and GPWS “don’t sink” caution had also occurred".
The pilots were suspended because they didn't report the full extent of the warnings, minimising them to "stick shaker".
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mikeosmers
Michael Osmers 4
I was clarifying your use of the term stall which is not the same as stick shaker as stated in the article.
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SkyAware123
SkyAware123 1
Just the fact they lied about what happened is enough reason to fire them.
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SkyAware123
SkyAware123 1
It's not a stall, it's a pre-stall warning. Correct-or-else.....
Alan does mention "warnings, including stall"
If it was an actual stall at 900 ft we'd be talking about how many people died.....

I bet you're a lot of fun at parties.
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saso792
saso792 1
The Aviation Herald has a little more information.
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mbrews
mbrews 3
The weather was extremely bad. Flight departed for Vienna approx. 3 AM local, one hour later than scheduled. The aircraft was scheduled to subsequently operate Vienna - Toronto. Possible case of get-there-itis ? Time will tell
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ericstrodthoff
Eric Strodthoff 7
It hasn’t been mentioned, but LLWS could be a factor.
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tintin
tintin 3
If they recovered safely and continued on without further incident why are the pilots being suspended?
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locomoco
M.F. LaBoo 11
It sounds as if the pilots' report omitted several other alerts that were recorded in the flight recorder data. If the airline felt they were trying to minimize or obfuscate the seriousness of the occurrence, they'd likely act as they did.
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tintin
tintin 2
Ohhh, that makes more sense. I missed that part.
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SkyAware123
SkyAware123 2
They lied about it ? That's enough to fire their asses.
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rickascott
rick SCOTT 2
While being a serious incident, this is a classic case of media magnifying every move following a crash. This reminds me of the USA Today”s 2 page pullout of “30 Reasons Why You Should Not Fly Delta Airlines” published back in the mid-1980s.
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mdwulfsohn
Michael Wulfsohn 1
Also somewhat reminiscent of when 3 different domestic Delta flights landed at wrong airports, I believe in the 80's?
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bchandl13
Brian Chandler -4
There's a reason Indian authorities are not sharing the black box data with Euro and American investigators.

I'd bet a lot of money that there was absolutely nothing wrong with that plane and the black box shows some absolute bone headed piloting by the crew that caused it.

Would not trust an Indian or Pakistani crew with transporting my luggage let alone my life. So many fraudulent crew qualification pilots in their ranks
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TimDyck
Tim Dyck 2
"…The black box is in India, with the Aircraft Accident Investigation Bureau (AAIB), which is carrying out a detailed investigation into the whole incident…”
Where does it say they are not sharing the information? It is being investigated and the information will be shared the same as any other country that investigates an accident in their airspace.
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SkyAware123
SkyAware123 1
Like most cases, it is likel to be human error. Then again, it was a boeing plane so who knows....
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CHRISMORGAN
CHRIS MORGAN 0
1) Your comment is both racist and ignorant.

2) Where have you seen that the Indian authorities have stated that they will not share any of the Black Box Data with the other appropriate investigators? Failure to do so would turn them into global outcasts in the aviation world.

3) Serious, constructive comment is welcome, your insulting diatribe is best kept to yourself.
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mdwulfsohn
Michael Wulfsohn 10
I agree, because (1) ANY airline, anywhere, is vulnerable to uncertified and false representations made by pilot applicants, despite the airline using due diligence to confirm and verify their resume' and stated qualifications, (2) ANY pilot can make mistakes, that's why there are at least 2 in the cockpit, (3) If the pilots' mistakes were serious enough to put the plane in jeopardy of crashing, then they should be suspended and fully investigated, provided the plane was otherwise 100% mechanically and electronically airworthy, (4) if you're concerned about an AIRLINE'S safety policies, or lack thereof, then fly on another airline, (5) most importantly, a pilot's gender, place of birth, ethnicity, religion, race, skin color, or sexual preferences, have ZERO correlation with ANY pilot's skills, experience level, intelligence, or ability to properly deal with an emergency situation.
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bchandl13
Brian Chandler 5
1) Except it's based on reality.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/25/business/pakistan-fake-pilot-intl-hnk

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-south-asia-12857742

2) https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/pune/black-box-of-crashed-air-india-flight-not-sent-abroad-it-is-with-aaib-says-civil-aviation-minister/articleshow/122054835.cms

3) My comment was fact based. You got offended at reality, decided to call me racist because your room temp IQ can't handle reality that hurts your feel feels, but unfortunately for you that doesn't make it any less true.
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TimDyck
Tim Dyck 3
I think you were called racist because of your racist rant. Leave the racism out and it would have been a good post.
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mdwulfsohn
Michael Wulfsohn 2
Mr. Chandler: I can't speak for Chris Morgan, but my opinion and comments were based upon what you said, and how you said it. Although the pilots may have been caught trying to hide additional facts and warnings, it doesn't mean that the pilots were the INITIAL cause of the catastrophic loss of thrust. Until the facts and investigation are completed, nobody knows for sure what issues are attributable to the pilots, and what mechanical or electrical failures may have been the initial cause.
Secondly, if I was an Indian or Pakistani airline pilot with an impeccable record, perhaps with considerable military flying experience, and a highly impressive number of hours under my belt, I would definitely be insulted by your comment.
My "room temp IQ" is pretty darn immune from being "offended at reality," or having my feelings hurt, and I respect your right to state your opinions, but racist or other derogatory remarks have no place in this discussion. Shall we agree to disagree?
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CHRISMORGAN
CHRIS MORGAN 2
No Mr Chandler, I am offended because your comments ARE racist, and inaccurate. None of the investigators have suggested that the AAIB is refusing to share any of the Black Box Data with them.

And as Michael Wulfsohn as stated (considerably more eloquently than I did) you are quoting 'facts' where, as yet, we do not have the answers, and trashing a complete industry because of your prejudices.

I wonder if you are aware that India is by far the largest source of foreign trained doctors in the USA and that Pakistan also contributes significant numbers to your medical profession. Let's hope that you stay healthy !!
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dmm323i
Daniel Moreno -1
With Boeing, I have to do two things: fasten my seatbelt securely and pray, regardless of whether I believe in God or not.
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Nooge
Nooge -1
Seek help for your BDS
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SkyAware123
SkyAware123 0
recent events have shown it's definetely not derangement. faulty software, doors flying off.... Need we say more ?
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dmm323i
Daniel Moreno 0
Amén,I hope you don't die with Boeing either. Holy Spirit and amen.
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